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 Post subject: Engine Catch Can
PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2006 6:32 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Seems everyone has the same ideas at the same times.
I started working on this earlier this winter, now I notice it is a major topic on T'Bricks.

Anyway this is my design for the engine catch can that I will be installing on the 5.0L V8. If you do not recognize it the body is an AC receiver dryer. Just carefully cut the weld open, cut and reconfigure the pipes inside, add a little stainless steel wool (a kitchen pot scrubber), drill a hole in the top for the breather and a hole in the bottom for the drain. Reassemble and you have an instant catch can.

For those not wanting to vent to the air the hole in the top accepts standard valve cover gromets so a vacuum hose or PCV valve can be added.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 9:51 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Location: It varies...
so the top filter is there...to vent

but do you set it up like these below? same way as far as tubing?

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ciao

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:37 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Tha VZA wrote:
so the top filter is there...to vent

but do you set it up like these below? same way as far as tubing?

ciao


You can as an option set it up that way. but I will not.

Because the V8 has 2 valve covers, each cover will vent into the catch can (one vent to each fitting) and then that will vent through the filter to atmosphere.

The option would be to replace the filter with a smaller grommet with a 3/4" opening rather than the 1" opening used for the filter (standard sizes and available everywhere) and install either a fitting or PCV valve into the top and route a hose back to the intake.

My issue with the set-up like you have illustrated is that it introduces inert gasses back into the engine, these reduce the efficiency of the engine and promote detonation (just what every high performance engine needs, lower power and increased chance of detonation)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:43 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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so cap the nipple on the pre turbo hose...run hose from intake to catch can...then vent to atm?

ciao

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:45 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Yup. maybe not aligned to good environmental practices but ...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 10:52 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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...it's AB so nothign i do will change anything the oilfield already does...


umm will this affect idle/computer/etc??? changing air coming from intake to pre turbo....not being there anymore?

ciao

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:13 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Will not effect anything, the turbo is drawing air in, if crankcase is vented into intake stream is occupies volume that will be replaced with air (which will actually support combustion). and at the same time not introduce oil and water laden vapours which gum up the intake and intercooler.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:16 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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i acutally understand this very much now

i always thought that it would not affect anything but i have read things elsewhere which contradict this etc

time to look for a catch can...a square-ish one :wink:

ciao

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:20 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Venting it to the atmosphere is best for power, but re-routing it to the intake of the car isn't THAT bad for power, and it shouldn't cause detonation, should it Ian? I mean, it's mostly inert gas and it's not all that much warmer than atmospheric air... If it were heavily laden with oil I'd say yeah, detonation city but that's the purpose of the catch can.

As a plus, venting it to the intake on a naturally aspirated car keeps the crankcase under partial vacuum, reducing windage and increasing economy slightly during cruise. This could actually be TOO much vacuum for the seals, but your cam doesn't make a ton of vacuum anyway.

In a turbo car venting it back to pre-turbo is the best you can do, so you don't get the strong vacuum effects like from a naturally aspirated car. Keeping the condensed oil away from the turbo pays huge dividends, though. Either method is good.

Not arguing here - I'm just throwing another perspective out there. I personally hate the smell of blowby and would rather burn it off than vent it out. I was forced to vent it to atmosphere for a while, with my old B21FT, because the blowby got so bad that if I let the car idle for too long, the poison gas would eventually slow down the idle more and more until it stalled the car. This was fixed as soon as I vented to atmosphere, but I had to pull that engine because the blowby was contaminating the oil so badly that I had to change it every three days to keep oil pressure. When I'd drain it, it would stink like gasoline... It was not an injector leaking or anything like that, 'cause I used the same fuel system without a single change on the next engine, and it ran perfectly. Blowby can be bad for power, obviously!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:59 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Location: Didn't learn, now renovating bathroom #2, and you think cars are expensive!!!
Love these discusions
I do not dissagree at all with you Matt,
Placing the crankcase in a partial vacuum has definite benifits.
With an NA engine the higher vacuum at idle reduces the risk of detonation (low to no vacuum at full throttle so no, or little crankcase gases drawn in). In a turbo engine the higher the RPM the more draw there is on the turbo inlet. (vacuum on crankcase hose dependent on intake restriction, or the amount of vacuum seen on the turbo inlet)

I think the ideal solution is to run a crankcase vacuum pump dumping into the exhaust pipe, this way you have the best of all worlds, crankcase evacuation, negative crankcase pressure especially at higher RPM's, burning of crankcase gases in the exhaust pipe. But these systems are very expensive and reliability is questionable on a daily driver

My plan is to vent externally initially and judge the results from there, if the fumes get too bad another routing will be used.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 12:29 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Location: It varies...
does location matter at all in the engine bay? i have a few places i had thought of, but regarding the smell issue...could i vent it to a fender hole?? think that would work? obviously not on the intake side

thinking about where my vac pump is now located, above battery right in front of the drivers side strut tower

or there's this option...

Quote:
My catch can will have a hose that goes straight out the back of the car and down a dolphin's throat


:lol:

ciao

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Last edited by Tha VZA on Fri Mar 24, 2006 12:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2006 10:02 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Location: It varies...
bump...read my above post...about location etc.

thanks

ciao

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2006 12:07 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Location really does not matter. Just keep it away from the cabin air intake

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