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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 1:25 pm 
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Bought PCV goodies! Yay!

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Breathe, my precious.

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 1:33 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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The CBV gets plumbed to the same place that the BOV should be now: a little line direct to the manifold. If you do ditch the BOV make sure you replace that hose or otherwise remove it - the same issue of boost leaks will occur, except that you'll be pushing out metered air (stuff the fuel injectors is pumping fuel to account for, that won't be there because it's been dumped overboard. Means the car will run rich as a pig.)

The original crankcase vent system went a little something like this: from the head and block it vents out through the breather box, which traps and separates oil & drains it back down through an often petrified rubber tube inside the block down to the bottom of the pan. From there, a short hose joins a Y pipe that often has a small connection to go to the intake manifold and always has a larger connection to join up to the hose between the air filter and the turbo. This large hose MUST go to the atmospheric side of the turbo, otherwise you pressurize the crankcase and push oil out of every seal. Invariably a little bit of oil bypasses the system and makes it to your turbo, which does get oily & gross from time to time, but this is the price you pay. When the engine ages you mix a little oil in with the intake air, which isn't good for the anti-knock properties of the engine but on a daily driver it works best. Drain out the intercooler every once in a while.

This system actually works well when plumbed this way - the slight vacuum between the filter and turbo helps empty the crankcase. Under low boost conditions the small line between manifold and Y pipe will add a little vacuum and may move things in the right direction, but I have been known to delete this and run a single large diameter hose between the block breather and the turbo inlet. Dumping the crankcase gas overboard is less efficient (and smelly) and through a catch can is worse, especially if it's vented to atmosphere. More restriction and less effectiveness.

By all means: change the valve cover gasket and get the seals needed to tidy up your distributor. Get a new crankcase breather box and plumb the system properly. If your engine is wasted (and it may be, by the sounds of it) you'll have that fight to fight next.


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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 1:48 pm 
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Please see attachment. So the piping that I circled is discontinued from Volvo, so it'll be a trial and error process to run piping without the BOV in play.

So based on the Crankcase diagram, I'll have to figure out where 7, 9, and 10 connect on the turbo/MAF side. Based on your description, is it:

7 to CBV
9 to the ???
10 to the MAF side

EDIT: I think there are duplicate hoses, which makes no sense.

Ugly Duck wrote:
The CBV gets plumbed to the same place that the BOV should be now: a little line direct to the manifold. If you do ditch the BOV make sure you replace that hose or otherwise remove it - the same issue of boost leaks will occur, except that you'll be pushing out metered air (stuff the fuel injectors is pumping fuel to account for, that won't be there because it's been dumped overboard. Means the car will run rich as a pig.)

The original crankcase vent system went a little something like this: from the head and block it vents out through the breather box, which traps and separates oil & drains it back down through an often petrified rubber tube inside the block down to the bottom of the pan. From there, a short hose joins a Y pipe that often has a small connection to go to the intake manifold and always has a larger connection to join up to the hose between the air filter and the turbo. This large hose MUST go to the atmospheric side of the turbo, otherwise you pressurize the crankcase and push oil out of every seal. Invariably a little bit of oil bypasses the system and makes it to your turbo, which does get oily & gross from time to time, but this is the price you pay. When the engine ages you mix a little oil in with the intake air, which isn't good for the anti-knock properties of the engine but on a daily driver it works best. Drain out the intercooler every once in a while.

This system actually works well when plumbed this way - the slight vacuum between the filter and turbo helps empty the crankcase. Under low boost conditions the small line between manifold and Y pipe will add a little vacuum and may move things in the right direction, but I have been known to delete this and run a single large diameter hose between the block breather and the turbo inlet. Dumping the crankcase gas overboard is less efficient (and smelly) and through a catch can is worse, especially if it's vented to atmosphere. More restriction and less effectiveness.

By all means: change the valve cover gasket and get the seals needed to tidy up your distributor. Get a new crankcase breather box and plumb the system properly. If your engine is wasted (and it may be, by the sounds of it) you'll have that fight to fight next.


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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 2:29 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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7 to the intake manifold and 9 (or 10, depending on your application) to the turbo inlet elbow. Yes, 9 and 10 are duplicates depending on your application.

Edit - oh, and: that hose should be pretty commonly available via junkyards & parts stashes, and you can run a substitute made up of silicone and steel if you need to.


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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 9:45 am 
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flipstah wrote:
woodenshoes wrote:
I would get a new PCV breather box and pipe it back the way it was meant to run. If you are seeing that much blowby then stick a catch can in till you can address the engine. Make sure you get the OEM box, many stories of the craptermarket ones leaking at the middle seam in the body, pretty sure FCP has the OEM's for not much more than the knock offs.

Would also agree that 8-9 l/100km is what you should be seeing on the highway, 10 is really not very good.

At 346K would also second the likely need for some head work, you mentioned the headgasket but the picture with the goobered RTV is the valve cover. Still, looks like father time combined with some suspect handywork by the PO means you have a few things to do, it's a turbo car so the headgasket/head are ripe. Also thinking that the original breather box is plugged so likely causing some of your oil leak(s). I would pull the MAF and clean it too, probably pretty oily. It's your money but I wouldn't bother buying Volvo fluids like the power steering fluid you pictured, they work fine with any quality fluid from crappy tire etc.


Awesome info. Appreciate it.

- I'm going to order at FCP for the original PCV breather box and a rear tail light assembly
- I was going pretty fast, so that could be the discrepancy but it puked oil in the DIY catch can setup (about half a litre for 350km of highway driving)
- There is no original breather box so it needs one, for sure
- The MAF is clean when I changed the air filter
- The power steering fluid is extra from my parent's XC90. My dad is an OEM stickler so he had extra ones for me to use
- Yeah, have to change the valve cover gasket for sure and I'm learning a lot from this vehicle. Mostly what NOT to do. Once I have the OEM parts, then I'll take off the BOV.


Fair enough on the PS fluid, what I was getting at was the pic of the Liqui-Moly and the comment that you switched to RT6. Both of these pricey synthetics which are wasted right now as you either leak it or burn it. It's great that you want to put in the best fluids but it's not going to pay off, and you have lots of other places to spend money coming up, JMHO. I noticed a jug of Pennzoil in the one pic, great oil that CT puts on sale for ~$17 seems like every other week. Has tons of moly and cleaning agents which will be good for your engine, the guys on BITOG think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread for a dino oil.

No one has said it but I'm sure your plan is to stage 0 the car and then asses what you have. If you change all of your fluids to good but not great fluid you will know that everything is fresh without breaking the bank. Once you get a handle on leaks and other issues go for the synthetic if you like.

Last thought is on the FE on the highway. What was your average speed, and how many RPM's were you turning over at that speed. Just wondering if the OD is functioning, pretty common failure on these cars as they age.

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:39 am 
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woodenshoes wrote:
Fair enough on the PS fluid, what I was getting at was the pic of the Liqui-Moly and the comment that you switched to RT6. Both of these pricey synthetics which are wasted right now as you either leak it or burn it. It's great that you want to put in the best fluids but it's not going to pay off, and you have lots of other places to spend money coming up, JMHO. I noticed a jug of Pennzoil in the one pic, great oil that CT puts on sale for ~$17 seems like every other week. Has tons of moly and cleaning agents which will be good for your engine, the guys on BITOG think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread for a dino oil.

No one has said it but I'm sure your plan is to stage 0 the car and then asses what you have. If you change all of your fluids to good but not great fluid you will know that everything is fresh without breaking the bank. Once you get a handle on leaks and other issues go for the synthetic if you like.

Last thought is on the FE on the highway. What was your average speed, and how many RPM's were you turning over at that speed. Just wondering if the OD is functioning, pretty common failure on these cars as they age.


Well, I do regret going LiquiMoly so you live and you learn. Everything else was going well and peachy though. I love Pennzoil, but T6 was on sale that week and my old Land Rover loved it.

As for fuel economy, I was averaging 120-130kph on the highway (sorry), and it was low RPM. My OD button does work. When I push it, an arrow shows up on my dash and my rev goes high. Very useful for over takes. When I'm cruising, I push it again, the arrow disappears and it hums like a monk.

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2016 5:39 pm 
First volvo in outer space
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flipstah wrote:
woodenshoes wrote:
Fair enough on the PS fluid, what I was getting at was the pic of the Liqui-Moly and the comment that you switched to RT6. Both of these pricey synthetics which are wasted right now as you either leak it or burn it. It's great that you want to put in the best fluids but it's not going to pay off, and you have lots of other places to spend money coming up, JMHO. I noticed a jug of Pennzoil in the one pic, great oil that CT puts on sale for ~$17 seems like every other week. Has tons of moly and cleaning agents which will be good for your engine, the guys on BITOG think it's the greatest thing since sliced bread for a dino oil.

No one has said it but I'm sure your plan is to stage 0 the car and then asses what you have. If you change all of your fluids to good but not great fluid you will know that everything is fresh without breaking the bank. Once you get a handle on leaks and other issues go for the synthetic if you like.

Last thought is on the FE on the highway. What was your average speed, and how many RPM's were you turning over at that speed. Just wondering if the OD is functioning, pretty common failure on these cars as they age.


Well, I do regret going LiquiMoly so you live and you learn. Everything else was going well and peachy though. I love Pennzoil, but T6 was on sale that week and my old Land Rover loved it.

As for fuel economy, I was averaging 120-130kph on the highway (sorry), and it was low RPM. My OD button does work. When I push it, an arrow shows up on my dash and my rev goes high. Very useful for over takes. When I'm cruising, I push it again, the arrow disappears and it hums like a monk.


Yeah, T6 is a great oil and can be had for a reasonable price on sale, the extra zinc and viscosity sure won't hurt you right now.

No apologies for doing 120-130 kmh on the QE2, if you're not doing 120 most everyone drives up your ass. Good to know the OD is working.

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2016 11:47 am 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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10L/100 on the QE (always windy) at 120-130 isn't that bad. Should be 10% better if you were doing 100-110.

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2016 12:50 pm 
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Anyone know a fabricator for sway bars? IPD and TB are expensive because of shipping.

$200USD used + $100 shipping

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2016 3:27 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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No, coil spring & sway bar manufacturing are specialized things that don't seem to want to deal with people on a custom basis. You can get custom wound springs made but a custom sway is tougher. It would surely cost more than $300 for a pair.

If you're cost sensitive, see if they'll ship them for cheap to At The Border Storage in Sweetgrass, and drive down to pick them up. Google them for more info.


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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2016 3:41 pm 
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Well, I'm saving up for maintenance + air suspension so that takes priority.

That PCV kit put a dent on my parade, although it wasn't big of difference to FCP vs. dealership.

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2016 7:03 pm 
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Slight snag on the breather box replacement.

Removed the old breather box and added a new one in. The previous owner drilled a tube through the oil breather into their DIY catch can. Hooked up everything again, and car won't hold idle.

Took off BOV; same thing. Replaced the hose that housed the BOV, to an original one, car won't start. Took off silicon hose from turbo to intercooler, and car starts. I control the airflow with my hand and car runs decent. The moment I complete the circuit, it chokes and cuts out. I unplug the MAF sensor near the air filter box and car starts lean. It doesn't like the pressure the turbo is giving?

Not really sure what's happening...

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2016 10:47 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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Look up "adjusting base idle". You've obviously sealed up some leaks the previous owner compensated for and need to adjust the throttle plate accordingly.

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2016 7:57 pm 
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So it was a vacuum leak and was able to solve it in time. Intake manifold gasket issue, but found a replacement part from NAPA.

Back to stock mode, and running better now. No more hesitation on first gear, and I still get 10psi of boost.

Anyone know street value for a manual boost controller and an HKS SQV?

Some pics of previous owner hackjob. Guess which one is the stock oil breather box lol

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Image

New hoses, box, many goodies...

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Goodbye, HKS thing.

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Stock everything!

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 Post subject: Re: Daily Driving a Turbo Brick
PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2016 6:32 pm 
Haha, I just built a W24 Octo-Turbo, now what?!
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That looks better! Sounds like it runs better too! Hopefully uses less oil and fuel as well...

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