I have no interest in lawyers, and fully agree people like that make insurance expensive. I have no interest in such things, and that wasn't what I was talking about. My contact told me that the insurance company will come to me voluntarily with a small sum of money as a settlement for injury to AVOID any further action. They want you sign a piece of paper ensuring you can't take any further action down the road. If that happens, I'll gladly take it to cover my pain and my time.

Jim, yeah, the 00R probably wouldn't happen. The driveline issues terrify me. Good to know the tranny might have been bad as well. As for the 05, it apparently is the owners DD, which is why its dirty. But having the seats redone does make me very suspicious. Never even heard of that, and in such a mild climate such as Vancouver's, it doesn't make any sense. I think you're right in that it reflects poorly on the rest of the cars maintenance.

Yup. I have a feeling I might be forwarding my experience at Volvo of Edmonton on to "El Douche." I think he might find it useful.

As mentioned I own both the 00 an 06 R's and when I first drove the newer R's I was blown away with how modern it felt, the great stereo, ridiculous brakes, and the effortless power of the glorious high pressure turbo I5...

What is surprising me now is that I thought for sure we'd be selling the '00 come spring as the new car was supposed to be SO much better...

Truth of the matter is the damn 00' is making it a fight. The simplicity of the '00 compared to the new car, and the real world DD of both cars back to back has me wondering if the '06 is really THAT much better then the older P80 chassis.

With the ARD Tuning reflashed ECU, R manifold, billet compressor wheel in the 19T, and ARD TCV (I already have all the parts except for reflash) - the older car would likely have the throttle response, and more power than the new R which would offset the power advantage nicely. The old car already sounds WAY hornier than the new car, and the 5sp's bad rep is usually a result of poor maintenance. (My 5sp auto shifts super sweet at 224K currently). Like the 6sp - if and when the car develops shift issues, 9/10 times its the valve body which can be rebuilt - but even that doesn't seem to be an issue if the tranny is flushed fairly regularly. (Did mine at 130K, and at 200K with AMSOIL ATF).

You say that manual is a must though, and while guys have swapped the m66 into the cars they're likely at 95% as far as retuning the ECU to account for the manual swap.

For $9k (edit - this car was listed a couple weeks back for $6k curious why the increase) it's a ridiculously good car. (In 2006 I paid $19900 for mine - with 0 regrets) and if you like project you'd have a hell of a budget to make that car into whatever you wanted, but a good $2k more and itd be every bit as fast as a newer R.

If you just want to enjoy the stock car with minimal mods then go for the newer R, with 6sp manual already.

If you want to bank a wad of coin and still have a GORGEOUS car to take the 00 for a rip.

FWIW: I can't honestly say which one I'll end up keeping as it really depends on which car I'm driving at the moment.

Price wise: my 00 was recently totalled and they paid out $7500 with a $500 buy back. I bought it back and fixed it for $2k with all the performance parts ordered and the ABM projector lights... It's such a cool looking car now...

The 06' I got for $16k, but with all the grief of the sale, and the new valve body
I'm into it for closer to $18k. It has 86k miles, and very well maintained. The car came with good winter set on factory Pegs, hitch, and cargo cover. The leather in the P2R's is well known to have colour wear issues, and the bolsters on my Nordkap seats need respraying - so as long as the leather isn't worn the colour spray is normal.

I'm not much help in advising which is the BEST car for you, but I'm happy to discuss each cars strengths and weaknesses so that you can make the best decision you can.

What I can tell you though - is the R line is absolutely crazy bang for the $$. Im still a bit of a hoonigan even at age 42, and the power either of the cars have is really just outstanding. (Decent highway economy too if you travel at reasonable speeds)

Rabin

Thanks for chiming in Rabin, it's great having yours and ktm's insight on the R series cars. I'm following all of this as I still keep thinking about an R, but am still on the fence for a variety of reasons not all related to the R ownership itself.

No worries at all Jim - I'm glad I can help give back to other members of this great little enthusiast group.

I quite stumbled on the R Volvo's when looking for the coolest family car in my budget, but being a car guy from birth I was blown away with just how good the car has been. The 06' is the better car there's no doubt, and when you think about how much bang for the buck they are (sub $20ish), it boggles minds.

Where the early car shines is how good they are for the price they go for now. The 06 is better, but its not 2-3x better if you do a purely bang for the buck comparison. The simplicity and still having a great AWD drivetrain with the honkin 260HP I5 makes it such a great car. It still has better brakes than most any other car, but the new R's are just ridiculously good.

As an example - the '00 was the car of choice for the holiday family trip this year.

Rabin.

Awesome Rabin. Some great input there. Greatly appreciated.

Good to know that '00 was listed for 6k not long ago. I've contacted the guy about it, but have yet to hear back. Very strange that the price would go up that much, unless he got something major fixed on it. I got thinking about what all you said, and realized it could be a pretty cool car. When those things first came out, I wanted one so bad, especially in Laser Blue. But then I started hearing about how bad the AWD system was. And that scared me. Still a possibility, but it will need very clean maintenance history to make me jump. A manual isn't mandatory...obviously my XC wasn't. But if its available, I'd rather have it if I can (ie. with the P2 car.

I'm amazed at how much some of these luxury cars depreciate. But it puts them in the hands of enthusiasts, which is cool.

While I'm a bit of a hooligan myself, the idea is that this car be the vehicle that takes me and my wife to the mountains and back. I still have (when its done) my 240 for playing around. The XC70 was preferred for this role due to its higher ride height, and ability to handle gravel access roads better. It went offroading just enough to get me where I wanted to go. But I've always dreamed of an R. Older or newer.

Also good to know the seats get resprayed often. Hadn't heard that before.

On the XC front, this just popped up in Vancouver.
http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/pml/c ... 59943.html

Exact same spec as my old car, and finally a clear description and service history. Sent an email, and the Manager of the dealership emails back at 10 p.m. on boxing day, with some notes about the car. Wow, what a difference compared to say, a week ago.

I bought my first R from a dealer in Edmonton, and when I called the dealership to schedule a pre-purchase they told me not to bother... It was a Doctor owned car that was fanatical about maintenance. He used to drop it off and request anything it needed be done.

He traded it on an Odessey mini van, and just prior to trading it had "spent a fortune" hunting down a drivetrain noise.

I spent 5 hours on the car in the dealership, made them open their service departmant and put it on the hoist for me. Price was listed at 26k, but was "on sale" for $19900 which they didn't budge from except to include tax.

Drivetrain issues? As long as the bevel gear doesn't start leaking and the tranny is flushed regularly its very robust. It's not Japanese car reliable, but then again maintenance isn't absurd. I love cars and tend to go overboard with preventative repairs, and I put the best bits back it whenever possible.

I really do love the 2000 R, and if you do find that the Laser is in top shape it should be a heck of a car.

One thing about the older car - while its AWD is great in everyday driving, the passive nature makes it a bit difficult to hoon as its FWD until they spin, then it transfers to the rear - so understeer is really bad when you rallycross them.

Rabin

"no claims over $2000!" but several under $2000? actually from shopping for the Subaru this seems pretty typical for Vancouver.
maybe I can drive it out for you and tow Fred's Ferrari when it arrives!;-)

lol...you read the specs on the 550? The thing weighs 3750 lbs

Holy cow - that's pretty much the same weight as the 06' V70R...

Rabin

Thumbs up from me!!! Might be better if the Ferrari tows the Volvo, but you can make that call.

I've been looking at this car more, and its pretty impressive. The Carproof is clean other than the one claim, which was just over $1,000 at the back end. Sounds like she backed into something. One owner though, and all service has been done. Looks clean, and is fully loaded....except for premium sound. Not sure how that's possible, but somehow they got a car with 4C and DSTC but no premium sound. Now, that's not the end of the world, but I like a good stereo, and don't want this car to turn into a massive project. The stock stereo isn't enough. So I've been trying to decide whether to walk or not. With this in mind, the price has come down to $16,500 plus tax, and they're waving their $395 "documentation fee." Still not cheap enough in my view, but if its as mint as he says, I might still go for it. Still have to pay PST and get it refunded, plus fly out and drive back, buy winter wheels and tires etc., so that all adds up, but I still might do it.

Dude wants the deal done before the "end of the year." Groan. He also told me someone else was going to buy it the one night, trying to pressure me into taking it immediately. No thanks.

Rabin, yeah, I would love to find a car with an owner who is that meticulous. Still haven't heard back from the guy with the P1R. Good to know they aren't as bad as I've heard....I won't be bagging the car, but I would at least like it to do a donut or two in the winter.

Donuts in a parking lot are doable when you get the knack for it - but is not as fun or easy as in the P2R with the Haldex...

I very much like the P2 XC's, and was in love with lowered (S60 AWD springs)
ones guys had done up with body coloured body mouldings... Pretty sure you can't lower with the 4C struts but not positive...

Curious to see what you end up with as the replacement...

Rabin

BAHAHAHAHAH!!!! THE PLOT THICKENS!!!

Remember this?
"Thought you might like a update on your Volvo.

A mechanic from valentine Volvo bought the Ocean Race and only found one thing wrong with it ...Low washer fluid!!

We sell great vehicles to great people

Merry Christmas Gregory."

Just heard back from the owner of the Laser Blue P1R. Super nice woman. And....guess who bought the 2006 Ocean Race XC from our man the douche at Trucks Unlimited????

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!

Her husband bought it without inspection. And of course the best news of all, he's not a mechanic at Valentine Volvo.
I'm just laughing my ass off. Finally I've got some more artillery to write him back with.

I kinda figured one day I'd find out the truth.

Holy crap that karma came round fast to bite that douche in the ass... Gotta love it when that happens!

More importantly though - I'm curious about the Laser Blue R... If you do take it for a test drive - I'd be very interested to hear what you think of it after coming from your XC.

Rabin

Yup!!! Karma indeed!!! I had a weird feeling I might figure out the truth someday, but I was surprised I didn't have to go digging for it so hard, and that it came so quickly!

Waiting for inspection reports and a VIN from the seller. They just got into town from Vancouver. Apparently winter wheels and tires are new, and summers are nearly new. I figured out the deal with the price increase from 6 to 9k. The current owner only has had the car for a month, before he found the Ocean Race XC, and had to have it. So the original for sale ad at 6k was from the original owner. The current owner bought it, got the inspection done, got all the required work done, and then found the Ocean Race. So now he's trying to recoup some of the losses, thus the new ad at 9k. The service records should tell me how much he spent, but I suspect it won't quite be 3k. Although the winter wheels and tires probably count for a fair bit of that. It will give me a better idea of what to offer I hope.

I'll give a test drive report as soon as I get one. Fingers crossed its this weekend.

Bean: if the car is in good shape, do you figure its worth 9k?

It would depend on the money spent so far, and the maintenance done so far - but with new sets of tires, and if the t-belt service has been done I'd have no reservation spending that kind if coin. I have no regrets paying $19k for mine 7 years ago and it sounds like this car is in the same shape and low km my car had.

I would also have to say that with skinnier winter tires, and increased ground clearance the older P80 R is functionally a better car in winter compared to the P2R. I need to find narrower rims for the P2R to fit narrower studded winter tires before it'll be better.

Feel free to give me a call if you like - I'd be happy to chat at length about not only what to look for pre-purchase, but if you do get the car would be happy to tell you what worked and what didn't during my years of ownership. (306 five one five - two four five six cell)

Rabin