The relay should actually be triggered by the first ignition event from the coil so it should not be powered with the key on...

That's right - the trigger for the relay is actually from the coil. It should run for a second or two after you stop cranking, though, so give 'er a whirl and see if you can hear the pumps carry on afterwards.

If that fails, you can try jumpering #3 to #5, and the pumps should run even with the ignition switch off. Then you can check to see if the car runs, but you'll have to figure out why the pumps won't work. Probably a desoldered connection inside the relay - VERY common. Pop the cover off the relay and you'll see a pin close to the plug with a gap all around it, and it might even look burned. Resolder that and it should work again.

Hmmm....okay, that makes sense.....I'm seeing that now on the wiring diagram. So really, it would be hard to hear the pumps while cranking. Yep, okay, making sense. I'll swap relays tomorrow and see what happens.

So does the intank pump only work when the main pump is working? I'm seeing that the pump relay connects to the #7 fuse, which gets power from the junction box/battery. From there, when triggered by the coil, the main pump gets power. Then, there's a red/yellow wire that goes back to the #5 fuse, and from there goes to the intank pump. So, if the relay isn't triggered by the coil, there won't be any power at the #5 fuse....? (I'm guessing right now...but this would explain the absence of power at the #5 fuse in the #2 key position)

Thanks Dale and Matt

Well, more updates as we go along....if anyone cares!

So, I traced power to the pumps. One thing I hadn't realized (actually I forgot...Matt already told me....) is that the ground for the pump relay on Turbo cars is at the boost overpressure switch. Since I'm not using a switch, I had to wire a ground to the ground terminal on the relay. I simply took the black wire that would go to the pressure switch, and plugged it into the terminal. Not sure if that's gonna work....that's how it is on the '79 harness laying next to my car.

So then, I traced power going to the pumps. There's power at fuse #7, there's power at the red wire at the relay, and there's power at the #5 fuse (intank pump fuse) when the car is cranking (as I suspected). The relay must be working. There's power at the plug at the firewall, power at the plug for the main pump underneath the rear seat, and yep, power at the plug right at the pump. So what the heck?

I had cranked the car over a bunch of times, and nothing....I couldn't hear the pumps. And then...right at the end, the pump switched on twice briefly while cranking....but the battery was dead!

What the heck?! Any ideas...why the intermittent pump? Or did I wire the relay ground incorrectly?

Greg

Volvo's fuel pump wiring was needlessly complicated, in my opinion. What it boils down to is that both pumps operate at the same time, so long as the relay is getting signal from the coil and there's both +12v and ground at the relay.

The overboost switch grounds the relay normally, and when too much pressure is sensed by the switch, it opens the circuit and shuts off the pumps. To disable the switch, jumper the wires, which permanently grounds the relay.

If you've got good power and ground at the pumps while cranking, they should run. Only the power is switched, so make sure you've got good ground all the time.

You probably can't hear the pumps while cranking, but you can certainly hear them after you stop - they should continue to run for a second or so, but if you've got a faulty relay they might not...

Thanks Matt. Good info there.

So I fiddled around some more today. I charged up the battery, and figured I'd give 'er another go. And....
chug chug.....VROOOOOOOOM!!!!!!

Its ALIVE!!! It ran for a couple seconds.
So after retarding the timing, and backing the car out of the garage, I fired it up again...except this time it started immediately, and then promptly redlined. Yikes. Tried it again after checking a few things, and pretty much the same thing, so I just had to shut it down.

Anyone have any ideas....why the no idle situation? Why is it revving up completely? Throttle switch is clicking, CIS box is wired to the coil. Ugh. More troubleshooting tomorrow.

That said...I'm really close now. I was so excited when it ran for the first time. I'm running low on time though, and I've been working a lot which stinks. And, my mechanic is full up and said its pretty unlikely he'll have time to do the out of province inspection for me before the weekend....

Noooo... your mechanic must make time!

Weird that it rev'd right to redline... is something jammed in the air meter/fuel distro keeping it open? Maybe pop the rubber top off and take a look.. I can't figure what else would cause it to dump fuel like that.. with the TB closed.

Not much help/not really thinking right now. Hopefully you can come up with something and get it inspected!

The reving to red line has to be an airleak somewhere. Probably the throttle body stickign open. Pull the cover and take a look in there. Engine will only rev up with air being sucked in, not more fuel being dumped in.

Jordan

Thanks Geoff and Jordan for your responses!

Well, at this point I'm pretty much lost. I pulled the IC pipe and looked at the TB. Its in the right spot, and snaps back nicely. So its not sticking. The air meter thingy is centered and springs back nicely as well. I have no clue. This last time I tried starting it, it didn't rev that high, but then it just died.....so that's new! Not sure why the change....

I checked into getting the car insured for the weekend, so if I could get it running good enough, I could scoot up there, and come back. Now I'm missing B.C. You can't buy daily insurance of course. I can get a temporary 5 day insurance permit with which I have time to go get an inspection done. Great! But then, with registration, you have to pay $25 for a transit permit just to go get the inspection done...but only after you've paid your $8 or whatever for the inspection piece of paper! Pending I pass the inspection ($80 or $90), I can then return to the registration place to get plates, and then I can get insurance. Unreal. Its all procedure. That said, I can drive my car up to Calgary on five day insurance (I can go anywhere on that), but I cannot drive to Calgary and drive around Calgary on a transit permit. I can only drive there, to a specified spot, (Avalanche Performance Technologies House of All Things Good and Pure) and then come back. I cannot just drive around. So insurance lets me do what I want, but registration does not! And I'd have to pay $25 to drive up there, and then another $25 to drive to get the inspection done once I got home! That said, its gonna be $360 to insure the wagon once I'm done, so that's good. Its just getting to that point....

More later,
Greg

Well, after fiddling with things, the car won't rev up like it did before. Not sure what I did....but that problem is gone.

It starts up beautifully now actually, runs for about 2 seconds and dies. If I pump the gas, it'll sputter a little, but still won't keep running at all.

Hmmmmmm....
Greg

dwell meter would be handy to check what's going on at your injectors (frequency valve). you won't get any feedback from the o2 sensor, so it'll be in warm up mode, but you'd at least be able to tell if they were at 45degrees like they're supposed to be, or stuck wide open. My guess is too much fuel.

Thats assuming you're 100% sure you don't have a vacuum leak.

Thanks Athal,

At this point, I'm pretty sure I don't have a vacuum leak...not 100%, but its not revving up like it would earlier.

After a couple more starts, it just wouldn't catch, and so now its not starting at all. I pulled the plugs, and they've got some gas on 'em, and look pretty bad. Not sure what that means mind you.....
Pumping the gas doesn't seem to have any effect on starting, or running, which is weird.
Sigh.

I'm taking the 760 up to Calgary. I'm pretty down my own car won't be there. Not sure when I'll be up yet, but likely sometime later tomorrow.

Greg

give us a call Greg!

403 560 2315....Viktor = Tha VZA

ciao

Well, after a fun weekend, I'm back at the car again....here's whats new.

Car wasn't starting AT ALL today. Turned out to be a bad ground at the relay. Once fixed, car would just start and die shortly after....like usual.

Over the weekend, I was peering under the hood of Dale's wagon, and noticed that his ballast resistor was on the passenger side of the engine bay, with a single blue and single brown wire. After peering at some pictures, and looking at the diagrams, I became confused. On the diagrams, it looks as though there should be two brown wires at the resistor....one between the coil and the resistor, and another going to the starter. In essence, it looked like the resistor sat between the coil and the starter. Well, on Dale's setup, (and another 240 turbo I looked at) it appears that the brown wire goes directly to the starter. (maybe you can confirm this Dale...) Although I found single brown and blue wires on the drivers side by the coil, I also found the same on the passenger side, where the coil sat for the stock b21f. I figured what the heck....

I wired in the ballast there, with one brown and one blue wire, and plumbed the single brown wire on the drivers side straight to the coil, as it was on Dale's car, leaving the blue wire there alone. After turning the key, the car ran much better, and changed rev's according to throttle position! It eventually will die, and will only run if I keep the revs up. So....I must have had it wired wrong, I must have read the diagram incorrectly.

Anyone have any ideas? Is it correct now? And....what's next? The car runs only at higher revs, responds to throttle input, but won't keep running for more than 10 or 15 seconds.

Thanks,
Greg

Need to check/adjust base idle, spark timing and mixture if you can.